myTh squisher

Well... but turning it around like that is arguable (therefore, I shall argue. smilie).

Gay people can't very well ESCAPE straight stories in the media, or at least the visual media. I suppose they COULD... but it'd be awfully limiting to ONLY watch gay-themed movies or read gay-themed books (and y'know, now I feel bad about calling them "gay themed". Ya never call a movie "straight-themed"...)

And besides, it IS kinna hard to explain why, for instance, I like to read and write Romance stories - but only if they're gay. Either gender - long as they're gay. I have my own theories about that (what makes a Romance interesting in the first place is the Overcoming of Obstacles to it), but... that's the kind of argument that someone would have to be open-minded to believe.

And you know how THAT goes...

you're statements only point out more clearly how uneven things are
why should it be possible for straights to escape?

it would be interesting to see a gay child learn to read or go to school without being 'exposed to' straight-themed books, straight 'family values', etc
before we have a true voice we've already been exposed

There's too much mature discussion going on in here.

Quick, someone *cough*Jack*cough* say something about feet and asses and tits so the world can right itself.

Aw c'mon - it's HARD to find a place with "mature discussion" punctuated by ever-changing siggies of Hawt Babes. I kinna like it.

*snerk, snerk-snerk* you said "tits"...

mature? moi?
(somewhere i've heard) i know you are but what am i?

* points at Sara *

SHE started it!

Damn skippy.

Don't you forget it neither.

Carry on.

p.s I'm rubber, you're glue, whatever you say bounces off me and sticks to you!

he brought up the little wifey

quote:

Originally posted by maTure :P:
you're statements only point out more clearly how uneven things are
why should it be possible for straights to escape?

it would be interesting to see a gay child learn to read or go to school without being 'exposed to' straight-themed books, straight 'family values', etc
before we have a true voice we've already been exposed

But how is a child to know he/she is "gay"? Everyone finds out in different ways at different points in their lives... It WOULD be kinna interesting to see what a child who was raised without ANY gender-specific input would be like - but then, psychologists have been on the look out for those since Freud.

They got all excited about a boy who was supposedly raised by wolves in France (I think) once upon a time. I think it turned out to be a hoax... can't remember. The question of how much of the "way we are" is learned vs how much is instinctive has always been a big question-mark.

i'd like to point out that he started it again

i agree.. there's no way to know someone's orientation at that young an age
but perhaps a hetero bias plays a part in the delay of some gays figuring out who they are
you need a reference to recognize yourself

Well, y'know how kids are. "Fitting in" is a pretty big deal (and for some people, it never seems to wear off, either). Most kids just wanna be "like everyone else".

No doubt there are some exceptions here.

When you hear someone say - usually insistently - that "I don't care what anyone thinks of me!" ask yourself why they felt the need to state that, then. Ahem.

i see your point about fitting in/wanting to fit in

i question that being the reason why i didn't figure things out until the age of 27
it's not like i was fitting in during that time

Heh, yeah, if you were 27, I doubt that it had anything to do with peer-pressure by that time.

So - perhaps you're just really, really dumb.

I'M KIDDING!

I can think of a few reasons why it might take someone 27 years (to "figure out" their orientation).

- it didn't seem important enough to bother "figuring out".

- it kept changing, and defying any one label.

- perhaps you weren't AWARE that there could BE such a thing as a "homosexual" until you were 27, or perhaps you just hadn't seriously considered the concept, for some reason. After all, *I* hadn't been thinking much about it until I got turned on to yuri romance... And now look at me (hangs head in shame).

- insert other option here.

I'd be interesting in YOUR opinion on why it took 27 years... I'm betting you have one.

quote:

Originally posted by maTure :P:
i'd like to point out that he started it again

I see that it's all him. Carry on you two.

One thing about Jack, he's good for discussions.

I heart ya old man.

introspection gives me knots in my stomach
besides i barely know ya

i'll fill you in manana after rest and thought

Fair 'nuff.

To make it even fairer - I'll show you mine, then you can show me yours.

So yeah, I knew about gay guys in high school - but I never really gave it much thought. I hung with the "Theatre" clique - sort of on the periphery - and a lot of 'em turned out, I found out later, to be gay. One even hit on me - but I didn't realize that till years later.

Anyway, there was no internet, so that was about it for exposure. And... well, I guess I'd just never met a guy I'd ever found attractive, at that time.

I joined the Navy out of highschool - and not long thereafter - yeah, lol, there were some F*CKING cute guys. Not many... but a few, anyway. So I guess I knew then that I was "bisexual"... it just never occured to me to label myself. It's not like anyone ever asked. And remember - there was still no internet. Anywhere. It never occured to me to be bothered by the fact that there were guys I thought were hot, either. So... I don't really know why... but it didn't. I was prolly hitting 20 at the time.

Well - it wasn't very interesting, but that was MY story. *shrug*

Becoming a homo-Romance freak was MUCH more of a surprise to me, and makes for a cuter story. But that's not what we're talking about, is it...

quote:

Originally posted by maTure :P:
introspection gives me knots in my stomach

do you think this might be part of why it took you to 27 to figure things out? (imagine me completely non-sarcastic and non-smartass as i say this. it does occasionally happen...).

quote:

Originally posted by Failte:
So yeah, I knew about gay guys in high school - but I never really gave it much thought. I hung with the "Theatre" clique - sort of on the periphery - and a lot of 'em turned out, I found out later, to be gay.

so you didn't know they were gay until later?

quote:

Anyway, there was no internet

same here

quote:

It's not like anyone ever asked.

ditto.. maybe if they had? who knows?
looking back i'm pretty sure the biology II teacher was gay.. butch as all get out

high school was quite awhile ago
but basically it sucked
i didn't fit in .. i thought at the time b/c i wasn't one of the pretty girls.. in retrospect obviously that wasn't the only reason
i don't think it occurred to me at the time that i was different in "that way"
i don't think gay was in my vocabulary
as you said - no internet back in the olden days

i remember "waking up" after finding xena and the original scrolls where homosexuality was discussed and there were even (shhh) gay people

ps.. i went to a small parochial HS (no out role models there)

This message has been edited. Last edited by: beauTifully tragic,

now i'm going to pretend that not everyone in the world can read about my life and inner workings



OK CRAP---I HIT EDIT INSTEAD OF QUOTE AND SINCE I HAVE MOD POWERS I SCREWED UP AND DELETED PART OF YOUR ORIGINAL POST BEFORE I CAUGHT IT. SORRY, TAM. MY BAD... HOPEFULLY YOU CAN REMEMBER WHAT YOU SAID AND FIX IT.


zoom zoom zoom i have CRS and doubt i'll remember

This message has been edited. Last edited by: beauTifully tragic,

quote:

Originally posted by maTure :P:
now i'm going to pretend that not everyone in the world can read about my life and inner workings

well...it's cheaper than therapy...

just think that while yes, techincally you are exposed to the world, mostly only people who care about you will see it...

Love is love man. Who's to say you can't marry a woman, but still be turned on by men. This world would be a lot safer place if there were more folks like you. I genuinely believe that people are sexual and that sexuality is fluid. If folks accepted their attraction to others, rather than ran screaming from it, there would be far less bigotry.

I've known I like girls since the 4th or 5th grade. How old is that? 10? The first crush I ever had was a girl in my 4th grade home room. She looked just like a young Linda Blair. I wanted to kiss her so bad I thought I would cry. I didn't even really understand it, I just knew I was really different from all the other girls, so I just kept quiet. I did, however, remain a tomboy. Thank god at least that part was easy living in rural Texas.

I learned about 'the gay' in Jr High at which time we had moved to S Florida. Hello Homo! We only stayed 3 years, but that was plenty long enough to figure out that I was homo - I mean home. By the time we ended up back in Texas for my sophomore year I was terrified to say anything and started dating guys. I snuck away to some gay bars while in college, but only had one quasi-girlfriend.

I actually ended up falling in love with a dude. It's a long bad Lifetime channel kinda story... we divorced - no more men. So that is the story of me and my gayness.

Oh, and I've been told that technically I am bi.

Are you people changing your names? "Stop the Therapy" - wtf is your NAME!? All of ya, for that matter.

And be forewarned - I'll be asking again. I'm bad with names. But I swear to god, I think you people are changing screen-names like you change signatures. Pity the newbie!

**pant, pant**

About my "turned out to be gay" friends. It's a funny story, actually. This "clique" was like, 6 people, half-and-half guys and girls. And while I was IN highschool, there were some hints, and like I say, lol, getting hit on should've been a hint... but I was young and stupid so didn't pick up on that. Heh. Gawd.

(I'd given the guy a ride home from school - I had a car, he didn't. So I'm parked in the apt. complex where he lives, and he pulls out this brochure from some bar in Texas. Cover shows this shirtless cowboy-type with a huge erection under his jeans. I think I just said "cool" or something... Was this like show and tell? heh. God. But I wasn't attracted to the guy anyway, so no loss.)

So - fastforward a year, and I'm home on leave from the Navy - and we all meet at Pizza-Inn or whatever. Afterwards, as we're all leaving to get to our separate cars, one of the guys asks the other two if they want to "go to the lake".

Well, hey, *I* wanna "go to the lake"! The lake is fun! lol "Uh... Jack... I don't think you wanna go to the lake..." "Sure I do!" lol.

Eventually, one of the girls told me that that was code for going to a gay bar somewhere.

Obviously, since this was in code in the first place, I wasn't invited. So... meh. If they hadn't been trying to hide it like that, I might have gone anyway (although, at the time, I still don't think I'd ever seen a guy I was attracted to). But, y'know... Meh, like I said.

And Indian Daughter (Name!) - Wasn't it Kinsey that said that we're ALL bi - just a matter of degree? But yeah... perhaps the MOST honest amongst us are those who refuse to pin ANY label to themselves and just say "I like who I like".

I talked (in the 'Net sense) to a "lesbian" (as defined by: long-term loving and sexual 'ship with another woman") who absolutely refused to call herself that - because she lived in San Francisco where they take their labels VERY seriously, she said. And that just wasn't her thing.

let's see sara i think you know
lush life = zoom (she can tell ya her name if she likes)
indian daughter = shawn
and, as i said before, wickeT/myTh squisher/sTop the therapy/other names with T = Tam
anyone else you're confused about?

Heh, well, TAM - apparently it was YOU causing me the most confusion. T = Tam. Tam of the Hawt Babe Siggie. Gotcha.

Btw - is it possible to turn off siggies? When I'm home on dial-up, it sucks to scroll down to the new messages just to have it scroll right back up as everyone's sig-pics load...

So Tam - sounds like you're my age or thereabouts. That's one of the reasons I came here, y'know. In both of my fandoms of choice (Kim Possible Kigo femmslash and Orignal slash), the field is crowded with mostly teenage girls. Which is cute and sometimes there are even interesting ones... but... y'know, teenagers have been in school their ENTIRE lives, and thus don't really have many stories and anecdotes to share. Even college kids. They just haven't done much except go to school.

Nothing wrong with that (waves to Cil), but I DO appreciate hanging with the "more adult" crowd, for a change.

lol - Gmail goes through all my e-mail looking for keywords with which to zap me with advertising. For awhile there, all the "other interesting sites" that Gmail tried to push on me contained the phrase "Teenage Girls". It was hilarious. And a little spooky. O.O